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mcastonOffline
Post subject: Head Discharge  PostPosted: Mar 08, 2010 - 06:20 PM



Joined: Apr 16, 2007
Posts: 39
Boat Summary: "Cathryn Gwen", Hull #141, 28 Cruiser
Status: Offline
Hi guys,

Can the head be discharged directly overboard without going into holding tank first?

I can discharge overboard by using hand pump that sits in wastewater holding tank.

If so, what position should Y-Valve (in closet), seacocks, etc be in?


Thanks
Mark

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Boat Summary: "Cathyrn Gwen", Hull #141. 1988 Cape Dory Cruiser West Islip NY
 
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kg4mdxOffline
Post subject: RE: Head Discharge  PostPosted: Mar 09, 2010 - 02:22 AM



Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Posts: 78
Boat Summary: "Walkabout", Hull # 153. Red hull, name in white letters on the side, fly bridge removed.
Status: Offline
Mark,

In the United States--all of it--it is illegal to pump a head directly overboard inside the 12 nautical mile limit and many areas are "no discharge, period". On Lake Champlain, Lake Ontario, in the 1,000 Islands and anywhere on any canal in New York and Canada any head discharge is flatly illegal. In Vermont (lake Champlain) you can not even have a hose connecting the head or holding tank to the thru-hull. Put in a big holding tank and use it, the head police will love you and its the right thing to do. If you really need a way to go direct overboard 'The Boat Owners Electrical and Mechanical Handbook" has pretty good plumbing diagrams. The answer to your question, yes it can be done but belive me, you do not want to be stopped by the Florida Marine Patrol, the Maryland Marine Patrol or a number of other official groups, including the Coast Guard, with a toilet system that is less than legal. Been there, done that, got the tee-shirt from a judge.

Bill
 
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mcastonOffline
Post subject: RE: Head Discharge  PostPosted: Mar 09, 2010 - 12:19 PM



Joined: Apr 16, 2007
Posts: 39
Boat Summary: "Cathryn Gwen", Hull #141, 28 Cruiser
Status: Offline
Thanks for the info.

I'll leave plumbing as is.

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Boat Summary: "Cathyrn Gwen", Hull #141. 1988 Cape Dory Cruiser West Islip NY
 
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ekroekerOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Mar 09, 2010 - 10:07 PM
Site Admin


Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Posts: 58
Boat Summary: "Sea Queue:, Hull #190. Fall River MA, 1989 CD28 cruiser.
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The restricted distance offshore is 3 miles, not 12, in federal law. For practical purposes, this doesn't make much difference to most recreational boaters.

The term "no discharge zones" really refers to the types of marine sanitation systems that treat waste and are normally allowed to discharge within 3 miles. "No discharge" means that even these marine devices are prohibited from discharging. Direct sewage is NEVER permitted within 3 miles, regardless of "no discharge" or not.

Rhode Island requires an marine sanitation device inspection and a multi-year sticker for boats considered residing in state waters. Florida is notorious for fines for boats that have any potential for discharge. Search the net for forums or state laws and you can see what is regulated in your own favorite waters. Transiting boats must generally meet whatever the local requirements are, although inspections/stickers MIGHT not be required of transiting boats.

Vermont law (Title 23, Chapter 29): (hence covers VT section of Champlain; NY has similar law)
"Every marine toilet on board any vessel operated on the waters of the state shall also incorporate or be equipped with a holding tank. Any holding tank designed so as to provide for an optional means of discharge to the waters on which the vessel is operating shall have the discharge openings sealed shut and any discharge lines, pipes, or hoses shall be disconnected and stored while the vessel is in the waters of this state."

Technically, VT includes gray water discharge in the requirement (in their definition of waste and as applied elsewhere in the law). However, this is apparently not enforced for transiting vessels. Resident vessels apparently must be so-equipped (gray water to holding tank).

Often state boarding law enforcement have a dye they add to your holding tank so that any overboard discharge is marked. (presumably this stains your hull and the discharge path so they can later tell if you ever did it, not dependent on just seeing the spreading circle of color on the water).

Coast Guard enforcement guidelines are that any overboard discharge must solely be at the owner/operator control. A locked closed thru-hull, with the key solely available to the owner/operator is normally considered to meet this requirement. If there are more restrictive state laws (such as on Lake Champlain), the USCG will apply the state requirements (hmmm, I'll have to ask STA BURLINGTON sometime about this).
 
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kg4mdxOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Mar 11, 2010 - 01:14 PM



Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Posts: 78
Boat Summary: "Walkabout", Hull # 153. Red hull, name in white letters on the side, fly bridge removed.
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Ned,

Sorry about the 12 NM, I was thinking of things other than the toilet; but it is worth noting that there are proposals to extend the head discharge control zone further offshore. Pending final review, on the Gulf of Mexico side of the Florida Keys as of Oct. 2009, the "no discharge" limit is 9 NM and may be extended to all of Florida Bay.

In August 2007, we returned to the U.S. from a "little loop" cruise at Rouses Point N.Y. and cleared customs at the Marina Lighthouse. We were in New York but we were required to remove the hose between our maserator pump and the thru-hull.

Years ago when we were still ocean sailing, we came in at Miami, at night, from the Bahamas. We anchored off Belle Isle at about 9 p.m., the anchor wasn't even set before the Dade County Marine Patrol wanted to check our head and the "Y" valve did not have a lock on it. The only reason we did not get a big fine was we had not had "reasonable and adequate" time to comply with the rules.

Bill
 
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